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SoonerTimes > SoonerTimes > OU Women's Sports > Most powerful hitter of high school players in 2017-Jocelyn Alo


Most powerful hitter of high school players in 2017-Jocelyn Alo
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VNSooner
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 Posted: Thu Jul 6th, 2017 10:43 pm

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http://www.flosoftball.com/article/58611-louisville-slugger-hit-club-danielle-romanello-jocelyn-alo#.WV64CIgrI2w

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 Posted: Thu Jul 6th, 2017 11:15 pm

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If Jocelyn is for real, and it is beginning to look like there are reasons for the optimism, she has an excellent opportunity.  She will come into a lineup that is already one of the most feared in the nation.  Alabama, Auburn, and, now, Florida fans are well aware of a lesser known power hitter, Shay Knighten, who seems to hit them on center stage.    But, as we once again saw during the playoffs, there is power in the top six hitters:  Mendes, Clifton, Knighten, Aviu, Romero, and Pendley can all kill you in big games.  You can't pitch around Alo in order to face Knighten or Romero. 

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 01:22 am

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VNSooner wrote:
http://www.flosoftball.com/article/58611-louisville-slugger-hit-club-danielle-romanello-jocelyn-alo#.WV64CIgrI2w

(y)

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 01:51 am

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sybarite wrote:
If Jocelyn is for real, and it is beginning to look like there are reasons for the optimism, she has an excellent opportunity.  She will come into a lineup that is already one of the most feared in the nation.  Alabama, Auburn, and, now, Florida fans are well aware of a lesser known power hitter, Shay Knighten, who seems to hit them on center stage.    But, as we once again saw during the playoffs, there is power in the top six hitters:  Mendes, Clifton, Knighten, Aviu, Romero, and Pendley can all kill you in big games.  You can't pitch around Alo in order to face Knighten or Romero. 
:ou: Imagine Mendes and Clifton both reaching base. Next up you face Alo, a freshman homerun sensation, one swing and down 3 - 0, if you walk her you face Shay Nighten with bases loaded and no outs. Thats what you call a pitchers nightmare.

Last edited on Fri Jul 7th, 2017 02:09 am by FANATIC

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 02:11 am

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FANATIC wrote:
sybarite wrote:
If Jocelyn is for real, and it is beginning to look like there are reasons for the optimism, she has an excellent opportunity.  She will come into a lineup that is already one of the most feared in the nation.  Alabama, Auburn, and, now, Florida fans are well aware of a lesser known power hitter, Shay Knighten, who seems to hit them on center stage.    But, as we once again saw during the playoffs, there is power in the top six hitters:  Mendes, Clifton, Knighten, Aviu, Romero, and Pendley can all kill you in big games.  You can't pitch around Alo in order to face Knighten or Romero. 
:ou: Imagine Mendes and Clifton both reaching base. Next up you face Alo, a freshman homerun hitting sensation, one swing and your down 3 - 0, if you walk her you face Shay Nighten with bases loaded and no outs. Thats what you call a pitchers nightmare.

Last edited on Fri Jul 7th, 2017 02:13 am by FANATIC

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 04:53 am

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So if it works out like we think she'll probably replace Hatfield's bat in the lineup. Of course we are still talking about a freshman not on campus yet. But she has been hitting monster home runs against top level club ball pitchers. So going on potential/reputation she is not only going to be an upgrade in the lineup but might challenge for middle of the lineup duties.

The main question is where will she play? The option I see happening is Aviu takes the open outfield spot and Alo is the DP. She's listed as a C/1B. From what I hear she's been playing 1st base for the Batbusters. With Knighten there that spot is filled. As far as catcher goes you still have Wodach and Elam I believe is going to be a better defensive catcher. Of course we still have Sparks on roster also. Another possibility will be the open outfield spot. Patty has moved infielders to the outfield before with success. Lets not forget Lombardi might get a hold of her and make a much better catcher out of her. If she can prove to be a solid defensive catcher could that be a possibility?Personally I like her somewhere else because catching seems taxing and seems to wear on a player offensively. I'm not sure what option I like. I'm thinking Aviu gets the early start in outfield with Alo at DP while Patty adjusts and figures it out like she always does. Another twist to this is lets not totally discount Alexa Shultz as your other outfielder. She might actually be the best defensive option coming in and also has some pop in the bat.

Last edited on Fri Jul 7th, 2017 07:03 am by cclift38

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 05:45 am

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I look for the alignment to be about:

RF Mendes, playing center as a junior
2B Clifton, remaining at second as a senior?  Arnold gone.
1B Knighten, solid infielder, could actually move to second, giving Alo first when Arnold leaves
3B Romero:  remaining at third as a senior?
LF Aviu
CF Pendley
DP Alo---it's her six for seven this weekend that impresses me more than HR.
C Wodach, unless Alo is a lot better than I thought at C
SS Arnold

Schultz---challenges in left
Flores---challenges as a sophomore
I see these as hitters waiting their turn unless they are really good.  Even then, when Arnold, Pendley, and Wodach leave, we have Lyons, Green, LeValley, and Skelly coming in.

I look for Lopez to become a lot more like Parker after they get her to move the ball as well as Paige does.  She has control, but she doesn't have the movement on the pitch that Parker does.  When she does, she will be very close to Parker--about the same velocity, better control.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 05:50 am

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You have to look at the current lineup and realize that Aviu just hit a two-run home run in extra innings of a championship game against a really good pitcher---Gourley.  Mendes hit home runs against Barnhill and Ocasio.  Knighten hit a three-run shot against Barnhill.  These were big hits against quality pitchers in a big time situation.

Are the Florida or OU pitchers better?  Are the OU or Florida hitters better?  We got the victories, I think, by having the better center stage hitters.  They may have been as good or better than our pitchers.  But, their hitters weren't as good and couldn't hit our pitchers.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 06:55 am

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I think we did have the lineup advantage over Florida. I believe it was their 2 hole hitter had a 313 average with something like 6 homeruns. Thats like a 7 hole hitter in our lineup. I don't know that anyone can outpitch Florida but you have to hit their pitching better than they hit yours. And they do have Lorenz who is a flat out stud.

I'm curious why people think Clifton will be removed from 2nd base. I've seen several post with that theory and just don't see it. I could see Romero possibly moving to short stop her senior year though. I've noticed Patty has been a little reluctant to put freshman at short. I'm as impressed with Grace Lyons as anyone coming in but she has the arm she could go to 3rd. I actually think Lyons is someone who could probably play anywhere you want. My moneys on her to be the other infielder with Romero/Clifton/Knighten. I'm high on Grace Green also but going to be a tough infield to crack her first year.

This team is going to be scary loaded.

Last edited on Fri Jul 7th, 2017 06:56 am by cclift38

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 07:26 am

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I'm looking at Clifton at SS her senior year, replacing Arnold.  I think she may actually be better than Arnold.  Romero has the quick hands, but I don't know about range.  So, I'd keep her at third.  I'm looking to move Clifton to SS as a possibility with Knighten shifting from first to second to get a Flores or Alo into the lineup at first.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 06:27 pm

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Patty hasn't had any problems starting a freshman at SS. The 2000 National Championship team had Kelli Braitsch. From 2009-2012 we had 3 freshmen starting at shortstop over those 4 years (2009-Karolyne Long, 2011-Javen Henson, and 2012-Jessica Vest).

Patty also hasn't had any problem replacing a shortstop that didn't hit well enough. Henson moved to 3B and then was replaced in the starting lineup. Vest became only an occasional starter after her freshman year. I remember Karolyne Long left the team, but I don't remember why. I assume she was the starting SS in 2010, but it's really hard to figure out.

I don't see Patty having 3 spots in the batting order under performing like there was this last year. We'll have more options this year, particularly in the infield. With Flores coming in, Kelsey could get squeezed out or one of the infielders could get moved to the OF.

Whoever fills the LF spot will be a hitter. It's possible that Patty will live with below average hitting at C and SS, as long as the defense is top shelf.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 06:47 pm

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I will be very surprised if Wodach is the starting catcher by the beginning of Big 12 play.  I believe Alo or Elam will replace her.  Wodach had 9 RBI's for the entire year.  Her play behind the plate was not exceptional.  I expect Schultz to be a starter in LF.  Aviu is needed as DH.  And as long as Alo is as good as expected, she needs to be in the lineup.  I hope her catching skills meet our standards.  If so, I think Wodach sees significantly reduced playing time.  Schultz is an excellent hitter with very good speed.  Elam and Flores should contribute next year, but I will be surprised if Alo and Schultz aren't starters by March.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 08:54 pm

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VNSooner wrote: I will be very surprised if Wodach is the starting catcher by the beginning of Big 12 play.  I believe Alo or Elam will replace her.  Wodach had 9 RBI's for the entire year.  Her play behind the plate was not exceptional.  I expect Schultz to be a starter in LF.  Aviu is needed as DH.  And as long as Alo is as good as expected, she needs to be in the lineup.  I hope her catching skills meet our standards.  If so, I think Wodach sees significantly reduced playing time.  Schultz is an excellent hitter with very good speed.  Elam and Flores should contribute next year, but I will be surprised if Alo and Schultz aren't starters by March.

Your prediction that Wodach will lose her spot in the lineup is not without merit. I still believe, however, that Lea's productivity this season was affected by her hand injury more so than any drop in skill level. Remember, Lea had good offensive numbers in 2016, and her play behind the plate and ability to throw out baserunners in 2016 was stellar.

Our incoming freshmen appear to be very talented. But if Wodach regains her health and is able to return to her 2106 form, it may be difficult for a freshman to bump her from the starting lineup.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 10:31 pm

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Lea seems to be a hot debate on here. I'm kind of on the fence. The broken finger would affect your hitting but seems to me her slump started the year before when she went behind the plate. She was playing left field and was actually smoking hot. I think she was batting mid .500's and had the most home runs on the team. As soon as catching started no more home runs and the average dipped to around 300. She was also stolen on more this season than last year. But that could be attributed to the injury as well. I think if you have capable catchers switching them out is a good thing anyway. Sparks got a lot of playing time last year and I don't think it was just because Lea was hurt. I think there was a bit of competition. I am a big Elam fan. She reminds me of a bigger version of Wodach. Cannon arm and from what I see is a good hitter. Middle of the lineup hitter for a really good Corona team. Of course Alo has the bat but is a wait and see on defense. I think if Wodach can hit in the .200's she'll hold her spot but is there is a 1 as the first number she will at least have to split time and could lose out if someone such as Elam can prove herself on defense.

I don't see Arnold losing her spot. I think she is one of Gasso's favorite players. She was probably the best hitter of our lower 3 for the most part. I actually think she'll get back up over .300 this next year. I don't think Flores is as good on defense as any of our current infielders. I've always penciled her in at 2nd after Clifton graduates. But that means she'd have to wait her turn. I do think she gets playing time as our main infield reserve. Me mentioning Gasso going away from freshman short stops is because of the recent past. Shelby Pendley was short and Arnold was 3rd her freshman year. Romero came in and was the USA JWNT short and moved to 3rd with Arnold to short. Personally I think Grace Lyons starts at short after Kelsey and everyone else stays the same. If its not broke don't fix it theory.

Here is something nobody has mentioned. Could Aviu get squeezed out? She's kind of average in the outfield. What if Shultz starts in the open spot and Alo starts hitting bombs and is the DP? Its hard to imagine and she would still get playing time i'm sure but it is a scenerio.

Last edited on Fri Jul 7th, 2017 10:34 pm by cclift38

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 10:58 pm

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I don't see Aviu getting squeezed out of the lineup; I think that there are several other players that don't hit particularly well that might get squeezed out of the lineup. I also think Alo and Schultz will make it into the lineup by March.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 11:09 pm

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cclift38 wrote:
Lea seems to be a hot debate on here. I'm kind of on the fence. The broken finger would affect your hitting but seems to me her slump started the year before when she went behind the plate. She was playing left field and was actually smoking hot. I think she was batting mid .500's and had the most home runs on the team. As soon as catching started no more home runs and the average dipped to around 300. She was also stolen on more this season than last year. But that could be attributed to the injury as well. I think if you have capable catchers switching them out is a good thing anyway. Sparks got a lot of playing time last year and I don't think it was just because Lea was hurt. I think there was a bit of competition. I am a big Elam fan. She reminds me of a bigger version of Wodach. Cannon arm and from what I see is a good hitter. Middle of the lineup hitter for a really good Corona team. Of course Alo has the bat but is a wait and see on defense. I think if Wodach can hit in the .200's she'll hold her spot but is there is a 1 as the first number she will at least have to split time and could lose out if someone such as Elam can prove herself on defense.

I don't see Arnold losing her spot. I think she is one of Gasso's favorite players. She was probably the best hitter of our lower 3 for the most part. I actually think she'll get back up over .300 this next year. I don't think Flores is as good on defense as any of our current infielders. I've always penciled her in at 2nd after Clifton graduates. But that means she'd have to wait her turn. I do think she gets playing time as our main infield reserve. Me mentioning Gasso going away from freshman short stops is because of the recent past. Shelby Pendley was short and Arnold was 3rd her freshman year. Romero came in and was the USA JWNT short and moved to 3rd with Arnold to short. Personally I think Grace Lyons starts at short after Kelsey and everyone else stays the same. If its not broke don't fix it theory.

Here is something nobody has mentioned. Could Aviu get squeezed out? She's kind of average in the outfield. What if Shultz starts in the open spot and Alo starts hitting bombs and is the DP? Its hard to imagine and she would still get playing time i'm sure but it is a scenerio.


Aviu to the bench is an interesting scenario. One that I think is not going to happen. Aviu has too many clutch hits and has for two years. She is a career .340 hitter with a .419 OB% and a .512 slg%. Also averaged 38.9 runs and 50.5 rbi's/y. Those are tough numbers for a freshman to duplicate.

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 Posted: Fri Jul 7th, 2017 11:19 pm

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I am not among those who think Wodach will lose the position, at least not easily.  Championships are lost more than won.  Mistakes kill you at this level.  If you remember, we won a title game because an outstanding player chose a time to be a bit of a showboat and lost control of the ball.  The result were the only two runs of the game that we scored.  Errors, both on paper and in execution cost you.  Defense keeps you in the game until the offense can hit a home run in the seventeenth.

Wodach was a good defensive catcher who caught runners stealing.  I think it was a combination of injury and worry that caused her to lose it a bit early this year.  But, she really wasn't bad in the playoffs.  I do wish they would teach her to hit to the opposite field.  She limits herself by having a hit zone of about twenty feet on the left side.  But, I think her defense comes back, and it has to take precedence at catcher.  I have not seen either Elam or Alo, but it would take more than just a good bat to move out Wodach.

Patty tries to give everyone a chance. But, she seems to settle on defense near the end of the year.

Aviu has been productive at crunch time for two years.  How many hitters have the stage precedence to hit a two-run home run against Gourley in the tenth (was it the tenth?)?  She gets those big time hits.  A lot of really good hitters don't hit a lick in the CWS.

A lot was made about the fact that the bottom of our order was zero for nineteen in the first championship game.  True.  And, it was that great that they were the ones who started the rally in the title game.   But, how many times did you hear an announcer indicate that the heart of a team's order were one for twenty in a game?  Some really good hitters don't hit in OKC.  Aviu does.  The thing that excited me about our freshmen last year was they they hit in OKC:  Clifton, Aviu, Romero, and Knighten.  Add Mendes this year.  You have to prove to me that someone is better than Aviu on center stage.  She's been there and delivered.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 02:19 am

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:ou: Patty has stated that if 2 players are competing for the same position are equal defensively, the player with the better bat will start. If Wodach gets her average up and is back to her 2016 sharpness on defense, then she may well hang onto her starting spot, but if Elam proves herself offensively and defensively, she could see alot of action getting her ready for next year. As for Alo, Flo softball has stated she will be in the starting batting order, just not sure what position she plays in the field. In 2016 Shay and Clifton early on battled over 2ND base. Clifton won the battle because Shay had some defensive struggles. But then Shay had a 5 RBI game and Patty says that I have got to get her into the lineup. Subsequently Shay ends up at 1st base and we know the rest of the story. If Alo proves to be a must have in the lineup, Patty will make some moves. If Alo takes over DP, Aviu will probably start in left field. If Shultz proves to be an all star type player and Aviu has some defensive issues. Then things will get very interesting. I agree that Aviu is a valuable hitter and has proven herself on the big stage so you want her batting also. Nice problem for Patty to have.

Last edited on Sat Jul 8th, 2017 02:31 am by FANATIC

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 08:16 am

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sybarite wrote:
I am not among those who think Wodach will lose the position, at least not easily.  Championships are lost more than won.  Mistakes kill you at this level.  If you remember, we won a title game because an outstanding player chose a time to be a bit of a showboat and lost control of the ball.  The result were the only two runs of the game that we scored.  Errors, both on paper and in execution cost you.  Defense keeps you in the game until the offense can hit a home run in the seventeenth.

Wodach was a good defensive catcher who caught runners stealing.  I think it was a combination of injury and worry that caused her to lose it a bit early this year.  But, she really wasn't bad in the playoffs.  I do wish they would teach her to hit to the opposite field.  She limits herself by having a hit zone of about twenty feet on the left side.  But, I think her defense comes back, and it has to take precedence at catcher.  I have not seen either Elam or Alo, but it would take more than just a good bat to move out Wodach.


I too think a healthy Wodach that can hit .250 is almost a lock to start. Wodach knows that Elam and Alo are going to be on the roster this year and it is her bat that will keep her off of the bench. Also I see JT attempting to get Wodach to hit the ball where it is pitched.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 04:23 pm

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I cannot envision a scenario – outside of injury – where Fale is relegated to the bench. She simply has been one of our two best clutch hitters (Shay is the other) from the moment she became a Sooner.

What I do anticipate is that Fale will remain our DP, the same role she's had almost from the start. With the freshman we have coming in, we've probably got at least a couple of players that are better than Fale defensively, but Patty would be crazy to take the bat out of Aviu's hands. And if there's one thing Patty ain't, it's crazy.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 09:01 pm

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:ou: The presumption is Alo becoming a must have in the batting order. Where are you going to play Alo, if Fale is the DP.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 09:16 pm

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If Alo were to be as good as implied, I could see some shifting:  Clifton to short, Knighten to second, and Alo to first.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 09:21 pm

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:ou: Your putting Arnold on the bench?

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 09:29 pm

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:ou:: Sorry, I don't see that happening. She is one of the best on defense at the SS position in the nation. She will be a senior and is the team captain. She is one of the players Patty feels is a must have in the lineup. Unless she gets injured, the bench is one place where she won't be.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 09:47 pm

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Arnold was the offensive anomaly on the team this year. Wodach was also way off at bat but hand hand issues and the movement from the OF to C appeared to also impact her hitting. Arnold on the other hand went from a career .354 hitter that hit .382 as a sophomore to a .265 hitter as a junior.

It is beyond me as to what to attribute her fall off to other than just had a bad year. With an off season to address her issues from this past season I expect to see her again become a .300+ hitter in 2018.

If she can hit .300 and one of the freshmen can hit above .300 with some power our offensive issues in the bottom of the batting order will be resolved and we will be a much better offensive team.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 10:32 pm

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Based on what I have seen, I consider that it would be easier to replace Arnold than Wodach.  I have yet to see a competent catcher who is a better hitter than Wodach.  Whether Elam or Alo  can catch remains to be seen.  I did not think much of the Dalton attempt.

I think Arnold has been exposed a bit on offense.  She is somewhat limited, and teams began to take advantage of her inability to score a runner.  She becomes a force out with runners on base since she almost certainly hits a grounder to the left side.  I suspect that the experiment with right handed hitting was an attempt to overcome that.  Slapping can become a liability if they come up with the bases loaded.  A slap is a force at home.

I think Clifton is a better replacement for Arnold at short than anyone else is for Wodach behind the plate.  Until I see a  replacement for Wodach behind the plate, Arnold would be my first person on the bench.  She is good on defense.  I actually would prefer Clifton, I think.  Arnold's fielding percentage has fallen from 981 (third base) to 961 and 956.  Her errors have gone from 2 to 4 to 9.  Unless we can replace a catcher, she is the weakest link.

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 10:33 pm

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:ou: Her batting Ave needs to come up. She had a couple of good games hitting in post season. Defenses were playing in on her and much harder for her to reach base

VNSooner
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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 11:38 pm

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When it comes to Arnold, I am with Cclift and Fanatic.  I don't see Patty moving Arnold out of the starting lineup at shortstop.  I also recall the growing pains with Shay at second and Clifton in LF.  I believe Alo and Schultz produce will a lot more runs and RBI's than Macey's and Lea's output last year, certainly enough to overcome 8 or so 1 run losses. 
Honestly, I cringed every time I saw Wodach come to the plate.

cclift38
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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 11:49 pm

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Knighten and Clifton were in a battle for 2nd their freshman year. Knighten struggled and made a lot of errors. But she proved she can hit so they put her on 1st and it worked. I just don't see shifting the entire infield to make room for Alo. Your benching Arnold(which isn't going to happen), putting Clifton at shortstop where she hasn't ever played in college, and moving Knighten to a position she struggled at. That seems like a lot of moving parts. Maybe its just me but you've possibly weakened 3 infield spots with all those moves.

Arnold wasn't a horrible batter. Batted .270ish, which is a drop off. She rarely batted as a freshman. They played her at 3rd and usually used a DP for her and Paige batted for herself. When someone else pitched she batted. I personally would like to see her bat right handed more. She has some power and I think she could hit .300 or better. Its not really her hitting. She's basically a soft slapper so the defense squeezes her. Makes her have to put down a perfect hit to get on.

To get Alo in the lineup to me its pretty simple. She either has to beat Wodach(and Elam) out at catcher, win the outfield spot, or be the DP. The next year Elam and Alo will be the only catchers(unless transfer comes in) so I'm sure she will get some behind the plate duty her sophomore year. Then you get Kinzie Hansen in the next year and she's going to be tough to keep on the bench. To me the best case would be if Alo turned out to be a solid outfielder. If not I think the best case senerio is to put Aviu in the open outfield spot(I almost think about moving Mendes to left and Aviu to right) and Alo is your DP. She could also be a backup at 1st base and catcher. If you'll remember Knighten coming off surgery was used at DP some. In that kind of case you could put Alo at first and DP Knighten. I agree with most everyone on Aviu, very good clutch hitter and I see a very low percentage chance of her not being an everyday hitter. But a note on that. If your just a DP and not a elite fielder if someone comes in and outhits you, then it is what is.

BTW. I'm enjoying the debate. So hope nobody gets mad on disagreements. Its the off season so not much else to talk about except some recruiting. None of us have a say in the end anyway. :lol:

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 Posted: Sat Jul 8th, 2017 11:59 pm

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I am worried about Alo's speed in the outfield.  I doubt she even has Aviu's speed, which I think kept her out of starting LF ahead of Macey.  I have seen Schultz run, and she has excellent speed.


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